Dear Marty,
I thought you and all who read your blog might be interested to know, that, in demonstration of the new “no disconnection” policy in Scientology, as stated by Tommy Davis just a couple days ago, this Scientologist, JoJo Zawawi, (in the photo) sent around the following to three friends of mine who then forwarded it to me. Evidently, JoJo was not informed of the “no disconnection” policy. Perhaps OSA Int was not informed either. Here is what JoJo sent:
“Subject: Sherry Katz
Dear ____,
Sherry Katz has resigned from our Church. She is committing suppressive acts and attacking the Church and making effort to pull people off the Bridge. I have personally verified this with OSA Int. I recommend that you delete your Facebook friend connection with her.
xoxox JoJo (Zawawi)”
JoJo Zawawi
Love,
Sherry
Martyrathbun09's Blog 
Sherry,
Read Tommy’s response to CNN about Paul’s resignation:
http://www.cnn.com/2009/SHOWBIZ/Movies/10/27/paul.haggis.scientology/index.html
Tommy’s lies to CNN by saying:
“To the degree that any one has an upset with the church, we always try and resolve it with communication,” Davis said. “I certainly had a tremendous amount of communication with Paul in resolving any issues.”
But the truth is that Tommy NEVER handled any of Paul’s concerns with all the “communications” he had with him.
Tommy, you only take order from your SP boss(DM), who attacks up stats (ie, Paul,Marty, Mary Jo, Sherry, etc…) and supports down stats (those who follow DM “command Perversion”. You are full of BS Tommy!
He is compounding the lies daily.
Thank you Truth..I have seen this response by Tommy. I guess neither Geir, nor Mary Jo nor myself are worthy of anyone’s “tremendous amount of communication” to resolve our “issues”. As a result, we got the same resolution of those “issues” as Paul did…nada.
How about all those hugs and kisses at the end, and gleeful smile? Remember the old illustrated tone scale – and the little sun with with smile, and the dagger behind its back? Has the organization and its congregation gone 1.1?
Unfortunately Marty the answer is a resounding yes!
Jo Jo is an example par excelance!!!
Hard to believe that the chick was on the Apollo with Ol’man or was the youngest grad on the HSDC internship!
Man she has turned into a Koolaid drinking clown just like her mother!
Sad very sad indeed.
Every individual’s reality is the result of their own experiences….
I would hate to think that people who we share common desires with, are to be reviled for temporary viewpoints, which will change with further experience.
Kool aid drinking clowns…..
The environment created by the former Kool aid addicts should be one where a better alternative is offered, not derision.
I, personally, pray to gods unknown, that my foolishness in life will be forgiven.
Marty Rathbun commented: “Has the organization and its congregation gone 1.1?”
Yes.
Truly degraded beings are drawn to brainwashing cults like moths to flames. The Church of Scientology is probably the most infamous brainwashing cult in the world right now.
My best advice, however, is the standard application of L. Ron Hubbard’s Scientology technology to undo the degradation and, likewise, handle the 1.1 scene.
“I have personally verified this with OSA Int.”
That’s the money quote right there.
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No, they haven’t gone 1.1 — clearly JoJo has no idea what is going on. It is extremely unlikely that the C of S has informed public Scientologists of these latest developments.
As far as the general Scns know, publicly resigning is listed as a suppressive act, and means an automatic SP declare and subsequent disconnection.
It will surely appear to JoJo and many a member that Sherry is pulling people off their bridge. There is no track in Scn of people continuing to be in communication after a suppressive act. There is also no track in Scn of people actively criticizing Int Mgmt and it is extremely common to think of Scientology = the Church of Scientology. In fact, there has never been any other way of thinking.
The trust in Mgmt runs deep. Compassion, understanding and patience is in order with public Scientologists. OSA is another matter, but you can be sure that they too have been given their orders.
What it means is that more education is in order.
Right Maria. Particularly along the line of management/RTC equals Scn.
There is a video being uploaded to youtube as I write this.
It is the interview of Nancy Many about her book, Billion Year Contract.
As soon as Aida ok’s it it is going live.
Tuesday, Tommy: “Disconnection cancelled”. Wednesday, OSA Int “No, it’s in full force”. My registered post letter asking for answers will be with OSA tomorrow. ENOUGH of this nonsense.
I like the way you approach business TNMN.
Setting this right means that DM will have to admit to messing with the disconnection policy letter and will have to rework and a reissue of the book Intro to Scn Ethics, various course packs and so on. As well, an honest and transparent line to keep public Scns informed would have to be set up. Right now the line is very shaky and very scary for most Scns that are on their bridges or still continuing with the C of S.
DM won’t admit to any wrong doing. He’ll find some innocent person to blame. He’ll then make an announcement that the SP who messed with the policy has been found, and ship them off to the RPF. Whomever is currently in his shit books will be the victim.
“We’ll see what happens to Scientology. One mark of a “real” religion is its ability to reform or adapt. Some religions could be said to begin as cults and over time transform into religions. Similarly, religious traditions, or parts of them, can also degenerate into cults. But cults generally don’t last long because they are so obsessive and rigid that they cannot change in the face of challenges.”
Front page — Huffingtonpost by David Gibson “Is Scientology a Cult? Is Paul Haggis the Next Martin Luther?
On the one hand, you have a bulletin that says disconnection is a “self determined action”, and on the other hand you have a policy that says you are guilty of a suppressive act if you remain connected to a suppressive or antagonistic source. “No bridge for you!”
Seems there is a horrendous misapplication of the references. Kafka would have been proud.
The funny thing is that I never “resigned” from “our Church”. As any one who read my statement on this blog will find..what I did say is that I can not in good conscience continue to support the current management of the Church of Scientology. What’s that definition of sanity again? Something like “the ability to recognize differences, similarities and identies”. There you have it.
Same in my doubt condition write-up.
I explained it very clear there. But; no. We must be put as “wrong” at all cost.
Roberto, how the hell are you? People keep asking me. Fill us in please!
Yes, please fill us in! Was going to email you but didn’t want to seem like a stalker.
Matt Lauer did a nice little review of the week’s events which aired in the Today Show I believe. Enjoy!
http://www.videonewslive.com/view/388078/video_crash_director_splits_with_scientology
I wonder if TC will be a guest again. Maybe Lauer would say “Tom you’re glib man, you don’t know the history of Miscavology, I do”.
COMMENT OF THE DAY ROB.
“I wonder if TC will be a guest again. Maybe Lauer would say “Tom you’re glib man, you don’t know the history of Miscavology, I do”.”
PRICELESS!!!
1: We are no victims. that´s for sure. Im not a victim.
2: We feel, we are alive and we care for our family. We have emotions.
3: I don´t know you; but I forgive. I forgive all the friends and family members that turn back on me. I forgive them ´cause I love them too damn much.
I forgive ignorance, non-care and cowardy in general.
Im on my feet again.
4. I know that family is very important.
Can´t be blind on that.
I will not permit such a thing to carry on happening.
Im working on the issue in and out Scientology lines; not just talking.
5. Thanks to all that write me support words. God and life bless you all…
Roberto Sánchez Núñez
Myself I loved them too but I don’t know how to forgive but I know that is best to do.
I was at fault as well. I should have trained when I could and because of that I did not I made big errors.
Hi Kat.
I don´t know you or what was the situation, but I can tell you that one need to undestand the degre of manipulation that can be achieved in a person.
Nothing worse that be treathen with inmortality; don´t you think?
Ex-Rpfr has the point on friendship. A true friend backs you up; no matter what.
Is sad to see that one has very few TRUE friends at the end.
If I can help you; write me.
Roberto
P.S.; I love Mr. Fresco´s work.
Roberto, you are a very beautiful being. The love you carry in your heart, your true caring nature, your integrity and willingness to fight for what you know is right…all these fine qualities will bring about true freedom for you, your friends and your family. It’s only a matter of some little quirk of time..
Thanks for your words Sherry.
Yes it´s a matter of time, patience, hope, confront and keep “hands on” improving conditions all around.
This way the victory is secured.
Roberto,
This short but sweet video should verify and validate what you’ve chosen to do:
Love has taken over and should be taken over (chosen over) disconnection.
Marty, let this video and it’s concept be your theme forwarding the ideas you’ve begun here.
I´ve seen it Mickey.
Thanks a lot.
It´s very good.
Roberto
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Every single one of us could have taken what was doled out to us, not wanted any more to do with any of this, and walked away. And it would have been understandable.
Can one person make a difference ?
OMG, look at all these ‘one persons’ !
Can ONE person make a difference ?
Just look at all of you !!
I commend you all. 🙂
Yeah, well….
It’s kind of getting crowded….
Hi Lulu Belle,
I know, isn’t it great ?
The more the merrier !
Yeah if it keeps going like this we’ll have 97 1/2 of the public and staff declared SPs and the other 2 1/2 left raving about their quickie grades and recent real estate purchases.
Well looks like the diligent are at it again. Harassment comes from all angles here. If someone were to follow even LRH’s definition of a true friend then no one would disconnect from their friends ever.
I cannot find the quote right now but I am sure you know the one I am talking about. Maybe instead of showing people all the flip flopping Tommy Davis is doing just show them that quote and ask them, “Before you heard anything bad about me, was I your friend or not?” And if the answer is that you were there friend then there should be no question in their mind what they should do.
Ex-RPFer, I like what you said very much and have had such thoughts. If you find the exact quote on the definition of a true friend, let us have it. 🙂
“What a true friend does. For one thing they stand up for one, give him council, they help him in adversity, they safeguard his reputation, won’t hear ill of him, share his triumphs, ignore his faults.” L. Ron Hubbard
That’s it; or very, very close.
Thanks Dagny I am saving that quote I am sure I am gonna need it soon enough!
Damn.
It´s beautiful.
Where does it come from?
Sherry,
DM and his group don’t have the guts to confront you,Geir, Mary Jo, Paul, Marty, and the rest of you powerful beings. You guys know the TRUTH and are constantly missing DM’s withholds. That is why, he can not “communicate” with you.
He created those problems (out-tech and off-policies), why would he want to resolve them with a good 2 way comm?
JoJo ‘s being a ROBOT! She is a great example of DM’s VFP.
Let me not to the marriage of true minds
Admit impediments. Love is not love
Which alters when it alteration finds,
Or bends with the remover to remove:
O no! it is an ever-fixed mark
That looks on tempests and is never shaken;
It is the star to every wandering bark,
Whose Worth’s unknown, although his height be taken.
Love’s not Time’s fool, though rosy lips and cheeks
Within his bending sickle’s compass come;
Love alters not with his brief hours and weeks,
But bears it out even to the edge of doom:
If this be error and upon me proved,
I never writ, nor no man ever loved.
–William Shakespeare
(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sonnet_116)
I can’y say it any better than that.
Love to you all!
All too common, we know the truth and so does the rest of the world following.
Marty:
You’re obviously a huge resource into the inner workings of organized Scientology. A question: Can you reveal any insights or observations or anecdotes about this policy? Also: This policy was allegedly canceled by LRH in 1968. If so, why was it instated in the first place? Have you ever been ordered to disconnect from anyone, either in the LRH or Miscavige regimes, and can you relate that story?
Thanks!
Yes – I’ll try to get a post done in the next few days on the subject as it requires some context.
DM must have read this
“If you want to really rule an organization, be so ornery and so mean and do so many overt acts that there won’t be an individual in that organization but will blame you, and after that they do everything you say.”
LRH
from R&D vol 9
Cause on All Dynamics
29 Dec 51′
As I went up the grade chart I noticed some people were calling Scientology a “cult”.
I never wanted to be in a cult as I defined it:
(a group of people who follow someone else’s orders blindly. Kool aide drinkers)
I started observing things in Scientology to see if I was “blindly” following anything. I was, to my horror, following blindly the idea of disconnecting from people HCO said were “SP”.
I have had enough injustice myself to know that HCO could and did make mistakes.
The big out-point as I see it is; if Scientologists really did “think for themselves” they would get in comm with Sherry and hear her side of the story before any “self determined ” disconnect took place. If a person heard both sides of the story and then made up their minds to not be in communication with someone I think that would be ok.
To do it with no direct observation and only on the orders of another is how a cult operates. I believe that if the CofS wanted you to think for yourself that they would encourage you to get the facts from both parties before even considering to disconnect on a self determined basis.
Obviously a person has the right to disconnect on a self determined basis. But to assume that the Cof S is always right and to never hear the other side is poor investigative work IMHO.
ARC,
Alex
Alex I think your post is spot-on.
‘Voluntary’ Disconnection is one’s self-determined choice and of course it is OK.
‘Enforced’ Disconnection is, well, what we are talking about here.
The only thing about “Disconnection” that was ever cancelled was the use of the word “Disconnection.”
If you look at the quotes from Tommy D, Mike R, Earl C, Heber J or any of the other spokespeople, have they ever said anything different?
The above email “disconnection order” makes me sick.
As is well known, when someone messes up a doubt formula you go into enemy, treason, confusion (Hi Tommy!). But there is another factor Ron explored, greatly, and that is the purpose – TO HELP. When one asks themself “Am I really helping?”, “Is management really helping?” and can’t clearly answer it, the wonderful experince of THETA doesn’t flow over one. One can experience “Failed Help”.
To put it into perspective, with a little known scale, called Pre-havingness (which was a further refinement of presession processses,”Help, control, comm, inteest”), Failed Help leads to Overts, Witholds, Importance (being important is like a low volume help, its better than having nothing!), Leaving, Protect (can’t leave, oh no, I will stay but protect myself), Abandon (To hell with it!) etc. This is explained in South African Congress, “evolution of early research-prehave scale).
So I think this email is one of these messed up efforts to have something, anything, but its well below sanity on help and “Judgement” that goes along with it.
Just to think, if we had the power, we could actually help these people…
I think we can, and will.
It is so good to hear from you Roberto. I was worried. I agree with you and think you are among the best human beings.
On a separate note, that LRH quote on true friend, is why I just had to hear what Marty had to say. To me he is and will always be a friend, he never abandoned me, I was not about to abandon him.
CC, I didn’t comment because I don’t have the quote to hand. I think you got the gist of it.
Definition of a friend.
“A true friend does…” “ For one thing, they stand up for one, give him counsel, they help him in adversity, they safeguard his reputation, won’t hear ill of him, share his triumphs, ignore his faults” LRH
Thanks CC.
A lot.
I want to be at the size of the opinion you have of me.
Do well.
Roberto
A friend told us that an Ethics Terminal in Zürich Org told her not to talk to my husband because he is unter Non-Enturbo (he wrote KRs about the high prices, showed pictures from empty Ideal Orgs, etc….). He is not even declared. That was about 6 months ago.
And that, Ex-RPFer, is the spirit in which Sherry should just go to the next Pasadena org event with a total non-confrontational attitude. (I presume there is no goldenrod with an SP declare of her as yet).
Allow me to explain my point.
Paul Haggis did what he thought he had to do. In my view the stronger action would have been if he had:
1.
a) focused on one subject e.g. Prop 8.
b) had addressed a PUBLIC letter to the Prop 8 people saying that though he is a member of the Church of Scientology he is opposed to the Church of Scientology San Diego’s stand re Prop 8. He could have at the same time pointed out that he was not a member of the San Diego CofS but of the CC – which is a corporately different Church of Scn.
2.
a) he could have send a separate letter/KR to Tom Davis about disconnection.
b) with no response received he could then have spread a new letter or shared it with others who had similar experiences, and getting them to write a KR too.
Having left the Church, there is only one position anyone in the Church will take: “You are out, get in comm with IJC and do your A-E steps.” But if you remain in and on-lines, you will be someone who has to be dealt with. You can be in a lot of people’s hair, you must be confronted every day as long as you are a member and as long as you are part of the Church. And while doing so you would make a lof of friends – and I do not mean this in a sarcastic way! And you would help bring sanity into the orgs by maintaining your ability to observe and look and communicate.
You see, I disagree in turning one’s back on the Churches and then pointing out from the “outside” what’s wrong on the “inside”. It requires strong people on the “inside” to maintain their integrity to create a change. An on-line public who writes a KR may appear at first to carry no weight. Or a public who talks to and queries the local FSO rep why Flag is now selling the Grades when that is the hat of the orgs. But if that one public Scientologist is joined by a dozen others and – after no action on the KR – who then send their KRs to each other as the next ethics gradient, then it will start to impact internally. Especially if these public refuse to leave. First one, then two, then more and more.
Scientologists who I am in comm with see and know the outpoints – mainly the obvious ones: the orgs are no longer asking what the public want – they tell the public what they, the org, wants. It is somehow a reversed application of the Non Existence formula. Or new org buildings being bought which are then empty.
Somebody I know drives a few hundred miles to go to study when her closest org is 10 minutes by car.
Why? Because she can’t stand the local org. If she would receive the copy of a KR written by someone who had left the Church she would read it, then discard it. If she’d act on it in any way she would immediately consider her future Bridge to be endangered. If however, she’d receive the copy of a KR from an on-line public in good standing – someone just like her – she would take notice; then she would receive the copy of another one, and another and another one. After a while she’d start to think it is the fashionable thing to do and she would write her own KR.
Now take this course of action to the level of staffmembers, first in missions, then in orgs then in the S.O. and you will, I think, start to see where this would be going.
Ultimately everyone of us bears the responsibility for himself and as much as he is willing to take on.
Call it a quiet evolution or whatever.
Thus my plea to those who read this and who are still on lines is to please stay on line. Find amongst your friends those who are like minded. Start writing your KRs and/or communicate your observations to others. No generalities. Only specifics that cannot be rebutted. No org can afford to engage in wholesale declares of a dozen people all at once.
Orgs, strong orgs, in-ethics and in-tech, are needed for KSW. LRH said as much. Do not attack them or turn your back on them. Help make them strong again – and that cannot be done by disconnecting from them but only by taking responsibility for them and helping each individual in them. Thanks for reading this.
AnEX
Dear AnEx,
I truly invite you to start a campaign of KR writing and sending them around to other public. Please do get in comm with your friends and get them to write KRs all the while of course discussing the scene amongst your friends in order to get them to write the KRs. Watch what happens.
Do you think for a minute that I or Mary Jo or Geir just pulled our support of church management before spending years writing up the scene and trying to handle it internally? You must not have read any of our write ups? You are seriously out of touch with what is going on within the church. But I’m willing to be wrong.
I would like nothing better than to be proved incorrect..that it can be handled internally. Please start and let us all know the results of your efforts.
Sherry
Sherry, I believe you’ve nailed it.
I do too.
Yup. What she said.
Mick Wenlock (yes, I know many of you don’t agree with his viewpoint on certain things) used to be on an Int Mgmt level with the IAS.
He once wrote a post where he said (I’m paraphrasing here) “Int Management doesn’t give a rats ass about anything whatsoever that a public person says or thinks about how the church is being managed.”
That pretty much sums it up.
You style yourself as an “Ex”, yet you counsel remaining inside and trying to handle the scene from inside.
So, either you are monumentally hypocritical, or you are not an “Ex”.
Which is it, please ?
Michael A. Hobson
Hobson doesn’t miss a beat does he?
Hi.
You´re welcome.
I read what you say several times in an effort to undestand fully; but I can´t.
Can you explain me please a little bit more what is your advice all about?
I just don´t get it.
I also would like you to do what Sherry advices. I would love to see the results.
Wish you the best and waiting answer.
Roberto.
Sir,
To the best of your knowledge, do you think there are reasons to believe Guilaume Lesèvre and Kurt Weiland may be victims of violence?
Do you know if they are in possession of their passports?
Thank you for your answer.
Both have received violence and Guillaume does not have his passport, and Kurt likely does not.
“She is committing suppressive acts and attacking the Church and making effort to pull people off the Bridge.”
JoJo Zawawi
“Instead of arguing with others, get them to look. The most flagrant lies can be punctured, the greatest pretenses can be exposed, the most intricate puzzles can be resolved, and the most remarkable revelations can occur, simply by gently insisting that someone look.” LRH
Some simply cannot see while some simply will not look….
There is a huge difference between them.
A wonderful quote! However, how does one actually get a dedicated scientologist to look? I have “former” friends (such as JoJo) and loved ones that cannot see and will not look, and I am at a loss as to how one gets them to look.
A moth is blind to anything but the flame. Find what their light is, and put it out.
Not to be confused with saying, put DMs lights out, it was just a bit of humour I could not let slide by.
ARC, particularly R is a vital tool. Then there is HCOB (also an article in ethics book) “You can be right” it gives tools. There is HCOB “Recognition of the Rightness of the Being”, “What is Greatness” (granting beingness, understanding where they are at. Most of us where there at one time or another). Definition of Pan-determinism. Being willing to respect that person’s right to succumb. Definition of Responsibility, Comm Formula.. Dissem Drill.
A word of advise for those still in – You can not hope to win if you walk up to some0one who got a great session and is VVVGIS and say, look at all that is wrong…
You need to bid your time, not invalidate the wins they do have. Don’t forget, some of us in are still managing to apply true scientology and win. (the church would have gone under long since if this were not true)
When they run into the inevitable off policy, either they will sour a little and you can gently begin pointing out the LRH references violated, or they will blindly accept and follow, if the later, you just wait for the time when they can see. That time may not come ever for some, but it will inevitably come for many. But if the former, then THAT IS WHEN YOU GET THEM TO LOOK.! Just get them to see the LRH ref, violated, get them to decide how they want to handle it, they will often write KRs. YOU KET THEM, because that is the standard thing to do. ( let’s try Scientology is right) they will experience the consequences of it. Now they can receive that comm. They can now see this websites. They will not until they have attained need of change, see. So that above is the winning formula. In my opinion.
I thought it poignant that today Ahmadinejad has made some conciliatory remarks that he is willing to discuss cooperation with Western powers. He has said “the West has gone from confrontation to cooperation.” — clearly, to me a way of saving face and yet it shows what diplomacy with a firm hand can do. Thank you Barack.
Bringing this closer to home and our concerns with the current management of CofS — rather than get into the very tempting mind-set of ire if we could collectively literally create space around those key opponents, granting them beingness, recognizing that at their CORE they too want happiness — just like all of us.
They have simply gotten further and further from their own hearts — and are now the embodiment of their own prejudice, fear and hatred. How very horrible it must be to be them.
We could, I believe, create a quantum shift by the simple recognition of this fact (creating space and granting of beingness) which will take some time to permeate into the core of these individuals —
AND at the same time — not let up on the exposing of the wrongs and abuses and harm caused.
Taking several pages from the patience and kind heart of HH Dalai Lama who has never ceased exposing the horrors of Communist China while always maintaining a non-violent way forward.
WH
I concur with Sherry — while it MIGHT be possible to correct the wrongs from within — I doubt it. Believe me there was PLENTY of injustice, favoritism, rumors, gossip going on in the 70’s — DM only got a smidge of power around 1978 as messenger on duty and then ran several flag missions. The problems have gotten worse far worse but the kernel existed back then. The kernel being the rampant power hunger than has just continued to corrupt.
I don’t believe that change can come from within — the only scientologist that I speak to from time to time told me the same. He felt that it’s from the inside that things will change. Really? How? It’s not even a question of courage or willingness.
How do you get your voice heard, understand and duplicated when the TOP holds all the metaphorical guns.
The Tibetan teachers who fled Tibet weren’t cowards nor stupid. They simply knew that would not be allowed to live OR if allowed to live, teach.
They left and thankfully have brought Tibetan Buddhism to the West — where it has become almost accepted and well thought of.
The WAY to ensure the survival of the tenets of LRH is to bravely uphold his teachings, decry the management, and build a strong independent movement.
Without this my prediction is that scn will fade away after a few more generations. It won’t have an iota of truth left — it will be twisted and bizarre.
WH
This is part of why I support the Venus Project. It will remove at least the money motovation.
All that will be left is duty and desire to help others.
I was able to get my repayment this year because I saw how Iran killed their own people. I saw the raw footage of the horrors they did to their own people so I realized you can’t fix evil you have to clean house totally to get rid of the evil and start over. I was hoping for a reform till that realization hit me.
Anarcho-communism = Fail. Let’s try Scientology instead – I’ve heard it has a much better success rate than communism.
That don’t seem to work so well has it so far?
Money always talks and always creates these problems.
But this is not the place to talk of this.
Save the tech.
WH good post I agree with you. I truly do not see the Church ever changing . There is so much corruption from the top down and bottom up.
I truly feel it is a tone level. Those left are truly at a low tone level. Those at a higher tone level can’t survive in an environment like what is happening, actually from both staff and public.
Oh Ye of little faith. You do underestimate both Scientologist and the power of truth. You also over value DMs power. His only power derives from us, Scientologist, it will be from within, all here who are now independents, are the within creating change. ( you came from within, did you not?) We still “in” are able to create effects with the simplicity of upholding LRH and getting others to uphold LRH. Truth has tremendous power, Scientologist are usually, more capable of truth, than you grant them. Me thinks.
Is there a possibility to get in touch with ksw1fan. Could be that i know her !
I think it need to be a two pronged effort, what we are doing here on the outside, getting the truth out there in droves and then we need to have people that are still active in the church working on letting others know the truth as well.
They can’t kick everyone out. Then there would be no one to reg.
It is true though that it has to be everyone. When I was in 8th grade every kid in my school decided to stage a walk out to protest a dress code still in force from 1950. We all got up from our chairs at 10:05am and walked out to the front of the school with banners and posters we had made.
The media came. It was great. We made a stand. That is what we need to do. Get everyone to walk out until everything is accounted for and things are put right.
Well, I happen to agree with Ex-RPFer. You see what Marty and company did was apply PR series 19. Found a safe place from which to speak up and spoke up. So this too is valid, declarations of independence are valid. People like me still in is also a valid approach.
You see, I remember the nightmare it was to get someone through their clearances to get to INT base. It used to keep me awake nights. The Int base is where management is, if no management, no expansion, orgs implode. Many still in will not ever look “out’. Then we “in” are there for them.
We looked “out” but stayed because we care for them too and we are able to help as much too. We might be “in” but will not be duped again, as Sherry said.
I will not leave, they will have to kick me out. Till then, I will go on applying Scientology. Besides, there is an “in” and “out” because of agreement it is so. I disagree. If you are a scientologist and use Scientology to any degree you are IN, in my book. Per KSW, it does not matter where you are in Scientology. Jim Logan has made this point quite brilliantly and as it’s usual I agree completely with what he said. The point is to do something to help keep Scientology working, as long as you are effective, how you do it is your decision. I appreciate all of it.
I once realized the incredible power of the following quote.
“ Courage would be summed up in 1 Being willing to cause something and 2. Going ahead to achieve the effects one has postulated against any and all odds.
There doesn’t happen to be any such thing as failure, there just doesn’t happen to be any such thing’…’You can mark the high tide of any empire or of any army in any period in the history of Homo sapiens, and you’ll find somebody someplace was deficient in guts and when he was, he lost the whole track. There isn’t even such a thing as “carrying on too long in one direction toward the postulated effect” there isn’t even that, there isn’t even such a thing as “there are too many odds” that doesn’t exist, there isn’t such a thing as saying, well, what I postulated was unreasonable and therefore I have to abandon that goal now… LRH PDC tape 42 1952
I spent 35 years in Scientology, most of that time as a Sea Org Member. I believed that Scientology could be reformed from within and that it would change. But 15 years under David Miscavige’s rule at the Int Base disabused me of that. Anyone who speaks out against him or criticises him in any way or challenges him is either RPFed or offloaded. There is no middle ground. All those who could possibly challenge him have been cowed into silence and submission. He has mobilized OSA to locate and stamp out any pockets of dissent. Staff have no choice – either they toe the line 100% or GTFO. Public have a bit more leeway – they can withdraw their support. They can raise their voices cautiously. They can write their KRs. All that is valuable and should be done. But experience has taught us that they will simply ignore such actions and carry on as usual. Or pressure the sources of criticism to shut up or be declared. I firmly believe that any real pressure to reform will have to come from outside the Church structure. I wish it were not so, but IMHO, that is the way it is.
The kingfish writes words of wisdom.
The COS is made up of individuals.
It is not a building or physical structure.
What LRH left for us was not made of stone or cement.
Scientology will prevail even if the COS comes tumbling down.
I must agree with WH’s post on creating a quantum shift.
How did LRH do it?
The problem is not the disconnection policy,
as one should disconnect or distance themselves
from anyone that is suppressive to them.
The real problem is that REAL Scientologist including SO members who have blown to get away from the suppression, are being wrongly labeled as SPs and thus being disconnected from by those that are PTS to the REAL SP.
Hey Janis. Hell of a point.
Leaving Scientology or speaking out publicly mandates disconnection, whether one blew or not or that one is declared for other suppressive acts. The victims of disconnection, Sherry Katz included, share an loss of self determinism and that is why disconnection is so wrong.
If you had not blown but had left on your own determinism, as many have and will continue to do, you might be afraid to say you’s left for fear of being disconnected from your father, old timer current member Peter F Gilham. But if you did speak up, even stating that you had left the church, you’d be fair game to being disconnected from.
One cannot just blame the fact that disconnection policy is ok except when it is enforced by goldenrod. This is a free speech civil right issue.
Nobody – my blowing was leaving on my own determinism. Routing out or blowing, was treated the same as a result, by blowing I was able to get on with my life faster than sitting around waiting to be abused. My father is disconnected from me so what you say makes no sense.
If a man or a woman or even a child is being abused by someone – that abuse is suppressive to their survival, in that case, the best thing to do is disconnect – that is what make disconnection okay. Disconnection because of a goldenrod full of lies or because someone left due to the rules changing or not what was said, does not make disconnection okay.
Vicki, you start by telling them the stats are down and they’ve been down since DM took over, and OSA refuses to show the stats to me and others who have requested. I’ve called OSA INT myself twice, I’ve had requests out to them for a month. There’s no policy saying I can’t see the stats. They won’t see how this is possible because they’ve been to the events and every one for decades has talked about explosive nuclear explosion expansion. Yet courserooms are empty and Buffalo and Malmo are flaps and Sanfran and NY are lukewarm successes at best. Ask why didn’t LRH discover that real estate is the why? And if it’s the why then why are these ideal orgs failing?
There’s about twenty contributors or more on this board who have seen the stats in recent years, me included, and have confirmed that they’ve been in emergency. From there just talk about all the regging and how that violates unusual financial solutions policies, I don’t remember the policy but it’s on this website.
There’s so many issues to cover but you hit them with the big issue stuff. I wouldn’t advise going into DM usurping Pat Broeker etc because that’s more speculative from their viewpoint, but I’d say the beatings and the fact that everyone is off post at Int is a good point because 15 people or so have confirmed this with firsthand observation. DM is single handing scientology.
The basics are pulling people off of the Bridge’s correct sequence, as laid out by LRH. F/N has been redefined etc etc. The mission network, once a source of 60% of Scientology’s income has imploded to Non-E and stayed that way since DM’s hatchet job in 82′ violating ethics and missions. “RTC passes” on missions have ruined them.
But when you start talking you need to give them a chance to disagree “Yeah but these people are disaffected and there’s a reason why some are prone to false data etc etc….” Just listen to them quitely and ack and they’ll stop and want to listen to what you have to say. When they say the basics are helping peoples bridge progress, just say the truth, they are helping, but then put it in correct context and circle back around to the stats, and how they need to hear all the data because the net effect is downstats and DM needs to be comm-ev’d for this. We aren’t making auditors right now. DM is “clearing the planet” from Flag and raping the orgs, so it’s just recycling of public.
Once you get them to look at the truth rundown videos on tampabay.com, you won’t have to work nearly as hard at it. Also you can contact me, boydh14@hotmail.com, and I’ll call them and talk. I’m in good standing. Just paid for my Bridge actually, but doing this instead. If they still ridge, tell them they’re investing their whole lives into Scientology, so they have a right to look at this website.
I meant violating “HCO PL Ethics and Missions”
StarsAwait,
You are definitley onto something. Nice, I like that.
Maybe I’m being a bit dim here (wouldn’t be the first time) but isn’t this very simple: 1) There is no such thing as disconnection, right? From the horses mouth. 2) You can’t talk to your son/daughter/parent because you are declared, or he/she “doesn’t want to talk to you”. Does this individual KNOW that disconnection is cancelled, and that therefore there can be no possible repercussions on them to seeing you? Surely one simply says to the terminal telling you this “Can you please show me incontravertible evidence that ____ KNOWS that disconnection is not enforced in any way, shape or form”. Without such evidence one would have to assume he/she is under duress to confirm to a non-existent policy or squirrel order.
Hey Marty, this is Antoine Young. Back in 1991 i Left scientology and sued them on the labor and wage law and of course won. I thought my then wife Joanna who is now in vancouver, would leave with me as well. We have a daughter who is totally lost in this disconnetion saga. When I saw you on television, I cried, I told my wife to see and hear you voice your issues with scientology, maybe my exwife Joanna will take heed. With so many of you coming out and speaking what I have been saying for years, should make the current scientologists re-examine the organization. I wish my 19 year old daughter would read and listen to you and others who have left and see that we all are saying the same thing. They broke up my marriage and made horrible false accusations about me. Now David Miscaivage should be pissing in his pants to see that the walls of scientology are now caving in. Good luck to all and I wish the best to you Marty. Respond back to me so I can refresh your memory on who I am.
Antoine,
Thanks for sharing your experience and perspective. You can get me at sthtexlensman@aol.com
Jo Jo should be sued for libel. Suppressive Acts? What the hell does that mean? And now that some creep has emailed a declare on Sherry all over the place, Miscavige’s church should get sued for libel as well. Indeed, they should be warned that further action will result in them being accused of a HATE CRIME. Why? Because the Church has a Fair Game policy which authorizes PHYSICALLY harming persons who have been marked by the Church. Basically, by emailing that hateful, despicable Declare, a Scientology Fatwa has been issued by Miscavige’s church. Miscavige Scientologists just love to play that Hate Crime card. Well, they are not the only ones. Food for thought.
As a correction, I meant JoJo should be sued for libel, not sue for libel. Dumb typo.
I’m sorry. I thought you were referred to someone else. That was not your dumb typo, it was me making a rare, and in this case stupid, edit.
Before, I asked for help. I received it, I was polished although only partially, I shined brightly. I was happy. I made sure I gave more than I received. I was given a lot of responsibility and I performed very well, according to Flag and my own statistics. It was stressful because the HELP stopped flowing. I was totally not-trained as an auditor, and bumbling along after some student auditing and flubby staff auditing and squirrely CSing. Still, I helped, I volunteered, despite how black the world of Scientology looked at the time.
Jojo is definitely PTS